Elevator clarification

[jasra]

Just to clarify, the problem with the elevators last year has to do with the doors.

If you hold the door open with anything other than the "door open" butotn, then it mucks with the elevator mechanisms and can bump the door out of its track.

If you lean against the doors, it mucks with the elevator mechanisms and can bump the door out of its track.

So, don't touch the doors. Ever. Use the "door open" button.

We'll be posting signs at the con, but if you start spreading the word, that'll help too.

Comments

[sethb.livejournal.com]

If you hold the door open with your hand, then it mucks with the elevator mechanisms and can bump the door out of its track.

Or your back, or your arse, or your suitcase, . . .

Maybe we should paint the doors daily to encourage people not to touch them (and to catch the idiots who do).

[jasra]

Text updated.

We're trying to figure out how to make it obvious that the doors shouldn't be touched. We're still debating that one though.

[sethb.livejournal.com]

The obvious choices are wet paint and pointy things.

[nippyfrog.livejournal.com]

haha!! This made me laugh. :)

[tisiphone.livejournal.com]

Dude, have you ever seen people around fresh paint? They'll go out of their way to touch it. No one ever believes a "Wet Paint" sign.

[nippyfrog.livejournal.com]

hahah that is true.

[feste-sylvain.livejournal.com]

With all due respect, the problem with the elevators last year was that the overwhelming majority of hotel guests use them very briefly as an alternative to stairways when going from the lobby to their room, while Arisia attendees use them as (to borrow a phrase from mangosteen) "vertical hallways".

To most hotel guests, the hotel exists in just over two dimensions, and the elevator is a rare-use item. To con-goers, the hotel exists in three very active dimensions, and the elevator (or stairway) is a frequent-use item.

The majority of hotels design and/or maintain their elevators based on typical use.

This will be true of any hotel we use.

[jasra]

Except that we didn't have this issue at the Park Plaza. So these elevators appear to be calibrated differently.

Stair use is very important, but it's also important to understand that touching the doors will likely cause issues.

[feste-sylvain.livejournal.com]

The Park Plaza may not have had the "skittery doors" issue, but there were frequently fewer than the apparent six elevators available after the first night of Arisia.

My point is this: science-fiction conventions overuse elevators. The failure mode may differ from place to place, but the fact remains we are not typical hotel elevator users.

In case it is not obvious, I do applaud all attempts for us to be better hotel guests, as well as being considerate to other con-goers. It is not my intention to claim that the elevators are doomed to fail.

[pathin.livejournal.com]

It's something of a fallacy that you claim typical 'hotel guests' rarely use the elevator. Many hotels, including the one we're using now, in fact cater to the convention crowd, be they Sales Conventions, Work Conventions, or Entertainment Conventions. Hotels make huge amounts of money in this regard; Far more then a standard night of hotel guests. It's -why- we're allowed in the hotels that we are. They put up with the hassle of so many guests in exchange for huge amounts of buisness they wouldn't normally see. With all cons, these are crowds that are frequently going to and from their rooms. Elevators that are ill-equipped to handle this task is a failure both of the hotel's management team as well as con organizers in providing us with a less then adequate hotel venue.

[curly-chick.livejournal.com]

All conventions overuse elevators--not just sci fi conventions. I have been to a lot of work conventions, sci fi conventions, and other conventions and it is the nature of the beast. I think it is important that we stop placing blame on folks who want to take the elevator instead of the stairs. People pay to stay at the hotel and attend the con and part of that is to so transport themselves which may or may not include elevator use.

That being said, I recognize that there is a problem with the elevators. And just like all other problems that will arise in any convention site, I applaud Arisia staff for thinking proactively about it. I think the suggested signage is a good way to mitigate the situation. I think placing chairs outside the elevator doors where people wait is also a good step (pardon the pun).

[nippyfrog.livejournal.com]

Part of the problem is that hotel is just too small..err... narrow. Plus things were all over the place. The art show was all the way on the top floor and dealers room was high up too. It caused even more of a bustle for the elevator because not only were people using them to get to their rooms constantly, there was everyone trying to get to dealers room and the art show. Tell me please that they aren't putting the art show on the top floor again. Can it be in a ball room somewhere? Ha! Same for dealers room! :P

At Park Plaza most things happened on the same floor. I used the stairs any time I wasn't going to my room because that made things easy. Mezzanine and surrounding areas/rooms was pretty much where EVERYTHING was, save dealers row and party blocks.

Maybe I'm behind on the loop - but is there any chance of ever getting Arisia back to Park Plaza? It seemed better suited for a con of our size.

[jadasc.livejournal.com]

Same for dealers room! :P

There is no dealer's room at Arisia 2008; just dealer's row.

[dda.livejournal.com]

Alas, the Art Show will again be on the 16th floor; this is due to several factors but the most important one is...lack of space elsewhere. While I'm sure many find the Art Show interesting, taking up the main ballroom (which is the only room of close to equivalent size) for most of the con would probably annoy many others.

Maybe I'm behind on the loop - but is there any chance of ever getting Arisia back to Park Plaza?

My understand is that Arisia will not be back in the Park Plaza in the foreseeable future; without going into too many details, I can say that scheduling for hotels is done quite a bit in advance and I don't believe the Park Plaza is available for our weekend anytime soon. Note that I'm not on the hotel committee so I could be wrong about this.

[liamstliam.livejournal.com]

I am going to have to agree strongly on this one.

Those elevators were in contant use and constantly filled and over filled.

Perhaps this year there will not be one out the entire con.

I have seen this happen at other places that don't do a lot of con-type business.

[perspicuity.livejournal.com]

i would argue that in most cases, in most hotels with more than a few floors, typical guests do NOT use the stairs, particularly to get into their rooms from the lobby. most hotel staircases are for fire use, and lead down and out but not back in. smallish motels and things probably rely on stairs a lot more.

point of note, many hotels, for whatever reason, don't even have obvious stairsways at the ground level, especially not allowing you to go up. yes, the park plaza has several leading the mezz, and from there, if you know where to go, there are some stairs going up (the set nearest the ballroom are usually one way only). the park plaza also has a maze of internal staircases at higher levels, but most guests never go floor to floor typically (that vertical hallway thing).

i would even go so far as to argue that at the current arisia hotel, most typical guests would never go near the stairs. elevator only.

which really makes you wonder why the elevators aren't in better shape.

doors going off tracks aside, can someone (arisia or hotel staff) who knows for sure, talk about the weight limits? it has been mentioned by several people that the elevators themselves juddered and shuddered and wiggled when loaded with people. scary.

#

[fireheart.livejournal.com]

I blame Wrath of Khan for this three dimensional thinking!

[madfilkentist]

These sound like really flaky elevators. If too many people stand in the back, it cantilevers. If people grab the doors as they're closing, it can break them.

I'll do my best to remember, but it's unlikely they'll get the gentle treatment from everyone that they apparently need.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

Yes, they are rather flaky, and the rumor is that the Hyatt has been spending some time over the past year chewing out their elevator contractors about the issue. One hopes that such chewing-out will have been productive.

[maverick-weirdo.livejournal.com]

Well, whatever you do, don't post the "don't touch the doors" sign On the doors.

[fireheart.livejournal.com]

Do not touch the doors. Do not taunt the doors. In fact, please refrain from looking at or even thinking about the doors during the convention. And try to refrain from thinking about not thinking about the doors as well. That may also disturb them.

[pryder]

Maybe a better idea would be to convince the hotel to fix their buggy, underengineered elevators. I've never understood why it is even POSSIBLE to overload an elevator with people; to my mind, an elevator that can be overloaded in that way is underdesigned.

Overloading it with heavy objects (say, dealers transporting books) is another matter. One might reasonably expect that a hotel would not bother to have its elevators designed for that load, as it rarely happens.

[undeadruler.livejournal.com]

Dealer's should be using a freight elevator to transport merchandise, and I can't see how a hotel of that caliber wouldn't have one.
People with luggage, though, are another matter entirely. I've seen people with some rather heavy luggage over the years. Even the toolbox I carry my games in weighs 35 or so lbs.
Still, I agree that a hotel elevator should be able to handle, without difficulty, 2500 lbs. That's more than enough for 8 people and their luggage based on the size of the elevators at the Hyatt.
Alas, just looking at those elevators, I have to say that those were designed for show, not for performance (delicate glass elevators as opposed to solid working class elevators).
And I do not believe the elevator company can just waltz in and upgrade the elevators to handle the load. Wouldn't they have to completely yank out the old pulley system and install one that could handle a larger load, on top of replacing the cars themselves?
And I agree, whatever you do, do not openly tell people that they can't touch the doors. Let it happen by accident on its own. In that instance it is more likely that people won't touch the doors afterwards due to someone elses 'misfortune' as opposed to being told they can't do something.